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 What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?

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pearlyriver
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PostSubject: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:32 am

Since Olys 2014 is just around the corner, I hope someone here can give their inputs on what Mao needs to do to reach her full potential at Sochi. Her team must have already had their own strategy, but I'm still a noob in skating techniques and presentation etc so I really want to read your suggestions. I admire her fighting spirit and confidence but I can't help worry that those characteristics may be not enough. She's on a deadline and what should her team do to maximize her strength and minimize her weakness?
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:47 am

pearlyriver wrote:
Since Olys 2014 is just around the corner, I hope someone here can give their inputs on what Mao needs to do to reach her full potential at Sochi. Her team must have already had their own strategy, but I'm still a noob in skating techniques and presentation etc so I really want to read your suggestions. I admire her fighting spirit and confidence but I can't help worry that those characteristics may be not enough. She's on a deadline and what should her team do to maximize her strength and minimize her weakness?
There is no skating expert, we're only fans, and her team has professionals who know it better then any other member here Wink But Olympics is Olympics, no matter how ready you're anything can happen. I think now Mao is in good position, she just need calmly to improve her technique and that is what she is doing)
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:57 am

my hope is that she chooses music and choreography that matches her highest potential. she's skating wonderfully to the programs she's competing with this season. however, let's face it. the competitive programs she's using now pale in comparison to many of her exhibitions. i want to see some of the magic from por una cabeza + payadora, caprice, ballade no. 1, and i vow to thee my country. i don't think anyone can beat her then. or, she can try a totally different choreographer which i seriously hope.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:03 pm

WEll, just was talking about it some days ago with my forum Russian friend. No matter what programs are you skating , what are you wearing. Technique what is matter the most, and transitions to the jumps, everything else is just depends on your choice)
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:04 pm


I agree with polosatik. The only thing to do is to keep improving and maintaining her momentum. Anything can happen at the Olympics. However, I do hope Mao will choose something more epic for her Olympic programs; preferably from a movie soundtrack. It will be a dream come true if Mao chooses to skate to soundtrack from Princess Mononoke. The soaring score and the theme of the music is just so perfect for Sochi. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 7:00 pm

She needs to get her current technical layout solid. However, with that, consistent spins, her gorgeous footwork, and amazing skating skills... she should be okay.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 8:44 pm

Her current technical layout should be ok and she needs to be technically solid on them and deliver consistently. Her SP at 4CC is already a very good start. Having amazing music and choreo will definitely help. I don't want her to reuse the same music (ex: swan lake). I want her to skate to something new and not another warhorse. Something new but still able to highlight her special qualities.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:45 pm

I would like to see Mao drop her 3F/3L combo in favor of a 3F/3T.

Combos ending in the Loop are rarely ratified, and again, this was the case at 4CC.

Question marks on whether she needs the Lutz or Salchow in the FP, as deductions are quite regular for our Mao.

Other than that, I hope she continues to receive Level 4's for her spins and steps, as it's a major strength of hers, and unfortunately wasn't up to her normal standard at 4CC. It's easy to forget how challenging that program was though *Respect*
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:13 pm

May I know what are the differences of score between (a) clean 3F/3L (b) UR 3f/3l (c) clean 3f/3t (d) UR 3f/3t?
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:21 am

kisses wrote:
May I know what are the differences of score between (a) clean 3F/3L (b) UR 3f/3l (c) clean 3f/3t (d) UR 3f/3t?

I used a jump calculation site. Very Happy
Assumption: Before the half mark of Free Skating

3F+3Lo = 10.4
3F<+3Lo = 8.8
3F+3Lo< = 8.6

3F+3T = 9.4
3F<+3T = 7.8
3F+3T< = 8.2

I hope Mao will keep 3-3Lo and will prove people (naysayers) wrong by nailing it and getting ratified.
If that happens, it will give hope and encouragement to young skaters too. Yep!

After watching Kevin Reynolds's FS @4CC, I'm convinced once again choreographers hold a crucial key. I wonder who she will choose for her choreographers 2013-14 season. Lori and TAT again? It may be safe but I want to see her to skate a program done by Kenji Miyamoto.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:51 am

linglang wrote:
kisses wrote:
May I know what are the differences of score between (a) clean 3F/3L (b) UR 3f/3l (c) clean 3f/3t (d) UR 3f/3t?

I used a jump calculation site. Very Happy
Assumption: Before the half mark of Free Skating

3F+3Lo = 10.4
3F<+3Lo = 8.8
3F+3Lo< = 8.6

3F+3T = 9.4
3F<+3T = 7.8
3F+3T< = 8.2

I hope Mao will keep 3-3Lo and will prove people (naysayers) wrong by nailing it and getting ratified.
If that happens, it will give hope and encouragement to young skaters too. Yep!

After watching Kevin Reynolds's FS @4CC, I'm convinced once again choreographers hold a crucial key. I wonder who she will choose for her choreographers 2013-14 season. Lori and TAT again? It may be safe but I want to see her to skate a program done by Kenji Miyamoto.

Thanks for the score chart, linglang...interesting that there's only a 1 point difference between 3f-3l and 3f-3t...the latter is definitely safer, yes. But I think it's worth giving her more time on the 3f-3lo and see first if she can achieve full rotation consistantly.

ITA about your opinion on choreos being very important, too. I'd like Mao to work with Miyamoto, and still Camerlengo. Jeff may be a good candidate too. Lori and Tat are great of course, but the problem is, they both have promising ladies for Sochi in their own countries who may want them to do the choreo for them. If that happens, I fear that Tat and Lori will have no choice but to hand their best ideas to their countrie's girls instead of Mao. Since I don't think Camerlengo will choreo for Caro, nor Jeff will choreo for Kaetlyn, I think it's better to consider them. Miyamoto may be the safest since he's Jpnse, but I think maybe Akiko might have him choreo for her, and since he's much closer to Akiko than Mao...hmm, makes me wonder if he's the best choice as well.

Anyway, if not Lori and Tat, I'd like someone who's capable of making a pro packed with complex steps and difficult transitions. Mao has the best footwork, she can handle the most difficult steps I'm sure. I think more difficult tranitions would do her good too.

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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:06 am

PochinkoPotanko wrote:
Lori and Tat are great of course, but the problem is, they both have promising ladies for Sochi in their own countries who may want them to do the choreo for them. If that happens, I fear that Tat and Lori will have no choice but to hand their best ideas to their countrie's girls instead of Mao. Since I don't think Camerlengo will choreo for Caro, nor Jeff will choreo for Kaetlyn, I think it's better to consider them. Miyamoto may be the safest since he's Jpnse, but I think maybe Akiko might have him choreo for her, and since he's much closer to Akiko than Mao...hmm, makes me wonder if he's the best choice as well.

Anyway, if not Lori and Tat, I'd like someone who's capable of making a pro packed with complex steps and difficult transitions. Mao has the best footwork, she can handle the most difficult steps I'm sure. I think more difficult tranitions would do her good too.

This is my main concern as well. Not for Lori, but TAT has Adelina and she's been hyped for years as the russia's biggest hope for Sochi medal, so I'm afraid how this is going to turn out. Lori has been doing choreo for Caro for years now, I don't see this changing, but somehow I always felt that Caro's programs done by Lori were better than Mao's who were done by her as well. scratch

I'd love to see Mao go to Miyamoto or, Dickson and Camerlengo. Swoon But it's not going to happen. No She's staying with Lori/TAT for sure, especially TAT since they have close relationship and Oly's are in Russia, unless TAT fires her.

Pochi, IMO, transitions are the most important for good PCS and GOE, and I agree, Mao has without any doubt the hardest footwork in the business, but judges don't always apreciate it. So many girls get a level 4 and almost as good GOE as Mao for their much ,much less dificult step sequence. Whirly Sometimes, I truly wonder what's the problem with the judges.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Tue Feb 12, 2013 5:13 am


To me, Kostner seems like a skater who is very involved in the choreography of her programs. I wouldn't be surprised if she gives a lot of her own input into the composition and overall look of her programs. Mao seems like she trusts her choreographers to know best and follow their guidance. When you look at her choice of costumes over the years, you really wonder what she was thinking when she chose to wear some of those costumes but then you hear they were given to her by TAT so I believe Mao trusts TAT to know best about these things. Lori and TAT are both great choreographers and each has produced great work for Mao in the past. But as time passes, their work has arguably stagnated especially since they choreograph for many clients. And although both ladies adore Mao, we know she is not their first muse. Few skater-choreographer collaborations can exceed those of Lori and Michelle and TAT and Yagudin. It would be wonderful if Mao works with Camerlengo mostly because he has personally stated he would love to work with her. It would be even better if she chose to work with a choreographer whose work is less used like Miyamoto or Jeff Buttle because then the person has more time to focus on a skater and create a vision for that one skater.
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:31 am

I'm in minority here cause to me, TAT priority is Mao not Adelina. You can tell it by her programs. Also,Adelina is not a top skater for now and she can't skate any program, so I think TAT making programs that are easy for her, while Mao is a prima skater who can skate almost everything. Also you have to remember(I noticed that by talking to younger skaters), every skater is comfortable with one type choreography, it's quite difficult to change choreographers. It even can bother a skater, no matter how wonderful it is. We had many examples in figure skating history when skaters changed their programs because it was not comfortable for them, and going back to their old ones. I think, Mao is not that consistent and with Olympics is coming I want her to be comfortable with her programs and if TAT and Lori again, I would be happy)
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:02 am

polosatik wrote:
I'm in minority here cause to me, TAT priority is Mao not Adelina. You can tell it by her programs. Also,Adelina is not a top skater for now and she can't skate any program, so I think TAT making programs that are easy for her, while Mao is a prima skater who can skate almost everything. Also you have to remember(I noticed that by talking to younger skaters), every skater is comfortable with one type choreography, it's quite difficult to change choreographers. It even can bother a skater, no matter how wonderful it is. We had many examples in figure skating history when skaters changed their programs because it was not comfortable for them, and going back to their old ones. I think, Mao is not that consistent and with Olympics is coming I want her to be comfortable with her programs and if TAT and Lori again, I would be happy)

I thought it over and I kind of agree with you more now polosatik. Like zarina said it's highly unlikely Mao will drop Tat and Lori for Olys season anyway, and if that's the case it means Mao trusts them to give her their best no matter which other skaters they'll be doing choreo for. Seeing Pattie having some trouble with his new pros show how risky it is to try a new style and keep your techs stable at the same time...I wouldn't want that to happen to Mao next season.

The other thing is...if Mao's going to go on skating to a layout like she did in 4CC next season too (and I'm sure she will), it would be better for her to work with choreographers she's used to working with. The jump layouts are damn difficult and risky, at least the choreo style being something she's comfortable with will allow her more to focus better on the jumps. The music choice I'm hoping would be something quite new compared to what she's chosen in the past few years, but other than that maybe it's safer to stick to the choreos she's used to. I'm sure that Lori and Tat will create the best steps for her again, as Mao is the lady with the best footwork, too (those Masquerade years did alot of good for her!).

Besides, however the choreo is, if she can nail all the jumps in her layout (as of 4CC), I think she'll have the highest chance for Sochi gold anyway. Plus I believe that most judges won't have the guts to score Lori's or Tat's choreos so low, even if there aren't many new ideas in them. They are still big figures in the field. In addition, Lori seems quite close to many of the judges...(I'm basically against this kind of thing, but if it'll benefit Mao, I don't mind at this point. There's no way to change how popular Lori is anyway!)

But I'd still like to see her try out working with someone new for her EX; that shouldn't hurt much. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:05 pm

transitions, transitions. i'd love to see mao step it up on transitions! cheers
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:25 am

I'm in the league of staying with TAT and Lori for the choreos. I also agree that the advantage of keeping on working with TAT as the Oly will be in Russia. One of the main reasons I support no change is that, by working with 2 different choreographers, Mao gets 2 programs that make nice contrast; most of all, the SP/FS are from different 'sources', and we won't get to see repeated movements or transitions in both programs. In my opinion, this will be a better choice than, i.e. Yuna works only with DW, and Carolina with Lori.

Actually, one thing I find interesting is that, I remember reading somewhere in GS that, Patrick changes from Lori to other choreographers this season, because Lori does not like to make any modification to her program. Well...but Mao gets to go to Canada to work with Lori on the SP! Perhaps Mao has a good reason to go back to Lori, as she wants to include the 3A in the program. No matter what's the real reason behind that, I just don't mind if Mao keeps on with Lori and TAT for the choreo. Also, don't forget that with the support of Team Sato, I believe Sato coach and Kumiko Sensei will help to polish the programs throughout the way!
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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:22 pm

Mao is on the right path right now. We are starting to see those improvements Sato warned everyone we must be patient for. I think there couldn't have been a more ideal time to put in both her 3-3 and her 3A. She has plenty of time to get them more solid by Sochi. We are seeing more and more improvements in every all other areas of her skating as well. So as far as her skating goes, she's doing the right thing.

As far as choreography goes, I've been wanting her to try a different choreographer forever Frustrated. However, I agree with you guys in the fact that she probably will not change in olympics season, and that it's not the most horrible thing in the world, since she obviously feels comfortable with them. It's not the season to fix something that's not broken (well some would argue that this IS broken, but Mao would disagree, and that's what counts).

The programs with Tat have been hit and miss. My favorite Mao program was from her, and my least favorite was from her. The music does have a lot to do with this though. It wasn't just the choreography. In fact, it was honestly the music more than anything that I did not like about those programs. So it's very important for Mao to choose good music next season. It worries me a little thinking about what music Mao might use for the olympics, since last olympics she choose two pieces I did not like (and majority of viewers didn't like much either), and I don't think she always makes the best music choices. I hope she chooses something that highlights her beautiful, light skating. So something not too heavy, yet something that's a bit epic, and has dynamics. Something that suits a gold medal performance.

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PostSubject: Re: What does Mao need to do to skate her best at Sochi?   Thu Feb 14, 2013 6:02 pm

Someone said, "The best season is only about a week a year. Smile If it is true, I pray the season is planed for Mao. Smile Also, keeping in good shape; ideal weight control for skating is important. If Mao believe in her, everything will be okay. Personally, I like Lori and Tat programs. They are good for Mao. They make her strong. They know Mao's beauty and quality. flower
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