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 Mao: post-Sochi news and articles

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zarinaballerina
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 02, 2015 1:34 am

WowMao wrote:
I thought I would post a little history I found and the lyrics to the music for Mao's SP program, Bei Mir Bistu Shein ("To Me You are Beautiful"). Originally written in 1932, I read that Sholom Secunda (the composer) sold the rights for only $30 and later split the amount with Jacob Jacobs (the lyricist) and that shortly thereafter the Andrew Sisters who were unknown turned into a big hit with more of a swing feel than the original in 1937. I have read that many 1920s jazz musicians and composers fell on hard times in the 1930s with the switch to swing like one of my favorites: Jelly Roll Morton. Now, that does really lend some sadness to the song for such a big hit to give so little to those who wrote and composed it, though I also read that they regained the rights in 1961.

The original version was a dialogue between two lovers who share lines in the song according to wikipedia but was changed when written in English so it sounds like just the woman /women is / are singing the words. This is my best guess.


Wow this is really interesting. I must say though I heard this song (the swing version) a few times before I never put any attention to it since it's not my style of music. I'm not a big fan of swing or jazz, but I prefer this song in swing version. Much more upbeat. Very Happy
This story makes you wonder how much more stories similar to this are out there. Someone composes a great song, sells the rights for "peanuts", only to see it becoming a huge hit, bringing in hundreds of thousands of dollars, yet the composer doesn't see a cent from it. I'm glad to hear they were able to regain the rights.

I wonder though, and this is something I've seen in the lyrics of Joss Stone's version I've posted above, and also on GS forum, why is the word schön written as shein? scratch



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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 02, 2015 5:52 am

zarinaballerina wrote:

I wonder though, and this is something I've seen in the lyrics of Joss Stone's version I've posted above, and also on GS forum, why is the word schön  written as shein?  scratch

I think it's because the original lyrics were written in Yiddish, and as Yiddish has its own alphabet (despite sharing a lot of words with the German language), it can transliterated in various ways. For example, this page with the original lyrics ( LINK ) transliterates the title as "Bay Mir Bistu Sheyn".

BTW, WowMao, you don't need to use Google Translate to translate the lyrics, on the same page there's a link to an English translation (in the top left corner, more or less). Here's a direct link: http://lyricstranslate.com/en/%D7%91%D7%99%D7%99%D6%B7-%D7%9E%D7%99%D7%A8-%D7%91%D7%99%D7%A1%D7%98%D7%95-%D7%A9%D7%99%D7%99%D7%9F-me-you-are-lovely.html flower

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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 02, 2015 10:04 am

zarinaballerina wrote:
WowMao wrote:
I thought I would post a little history I found and the lyrics to the music for Mao's SP program, Bei Mir Bistu Shein ("To Me You are Beautiful"). Originally written in 1932, I read that Sholom Secunda (the composer) sold the rights for only $30 and later split the amount with Jacob Jacobs (the lyricist) and that shortly thereafter the Andrew Sisters who were unknown turned into a big hit with more of a swing feel than the original in 1937. I have read that many 1920s jazz musicians and composers fell on hard times in the 1930s with the switch to swing like one of my favorites: Jelly Roll Morton. Now, that does really lend some sadness to the song for such a big hit to give so little to those who wrote and composed it, though I also read that they regained the rights in 1961.

The original version was a dialogue between two lovers who share lines in the song according to wikipedia but was changed when written in English so it sounds like just the woman /women is / are singing the words. This is my best guess.


Wow this is really interesting. I must say though I heard this song (the swing version) a few times before I never put any attention to it since it's not my style of music. I'm not a big fan of swing or jazz, but I prefer this song in swing version. Much more upbeat. Very Happy  
This story makes you wonder how much more stories similar to this are out there. Someone composes a great song, sells the rights for "peanuts", only to see it becoming a huge hit, bringing in hundreds of thousands of dollars, yet the composer doesn't see a cent from it. I'm glad to hear they were able to regain the rights.

I wonder though, and this is something I've seen in the lyrics of Joss Stone's version I've posted above, and also on GS forum, why is the word schön  written as shein?  scratch




zarinaballerina I know one sad story about a famous American singer named Jim Croce, who had many hits and even number 1 songs "Bad, Bad Leroy Brown" and "Time in a Bottle" (after his death) from the 1970s who was forced to stay away from his family well over 300 days a year on the road and made very little money despite his huge success because of the record contract he signed. He died in an airplane crash while touring. Again after his death, his wife gained better rights for his songs which are still often played on Oldies radio stations today.

There are other examples like the musical group Badfinger also from the 1970s, whose manager actually stole money from them.

I prefer the Yiddish version for Mao's SP because the instruments and vocalist harmonize in such a soulful heartache and climatic finish. To me the other versions I have heard (though I haven't heard that many) don't have the emotional depth and dynamics in build up to the conclusion that the original does. To be fair, I think the Andrew Sisters have wonderful harmonies and their version is great as a romantic swing dance song.

Thanks inskate for the information about the translation.
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 02, 2015 10:08 am

What version of Madame Butterfly would you like Mao to use?  The number 1 version on youtube in terms of view count is this one by Maria Callas. Honestly, I am not a big fan of straight opera like I am of classical music, but the vocals are impressive and quite emotional. It just seems so desperate and dark but remarkably powerful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN9Dipgqdtw

There is this version which has the dynamic of male and female romantic interaction:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcQNjV-YSiM

But again, to me the vocals can drown out the focus on the skating. If vocals were thrown in intermittently with the instrumentals I think I would like these versions, probably the first a bit more.

I know it may sound like going a bit too far and maybe it is, but I can't help wondering what it would be like if Mao performed Madame Butterfly with traditional white Japanese makeup as the woman in the second video is wearing and like Mao wore in her AirWeave commercials. It would be quite a theatrical experience.

Mao's Airweave Commercial in traditional white makeup:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=eciWxJCpwAU&app=desktop

To be honest, the only thing difficult for me to believe about Mao portraying Butterfly in the story is that I can't imagine any man would be foolish enough to leave behind someone as beautiful and charming as Mao. But then again, Mao is a marvelous actress on ice.

There is also this instrumental performance that sounds moving and haunting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utyOs24DUV4

What do the rest of you think of these versions and do you know of any other versions that would make for a great performance? Do you prefer Mao to have vocals or no vocals in her Madame Butterfly LP?

Here are some past Madame Butterfly performances that may help you decide:

Kristi Yamaguchi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q637NhSOHpk

Mirai Nagasu Skate America 2014: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRgG6A0Fm-o

Marin Honda Junior Nationals 2014: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2c...onals-fs_sport

Shizuka Arakawa: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFPsZcks3zw


Last edited by WowMao on Sat Jul 04, 2015 12:46 am; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 02, 2015 10:19 am

I'm not a vocal fan, so I'll go with the instrumental one...
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:35 am

l-spiralmao wrote:
I'm not a vocal fan, so I'll go with the instrumental one...

Thanks l-spiralmao for the response. I like the instrumental better too, but I hope there could be just a little bit of singing for maybe a half a minute or so because it may add to the drama of the performance.

Here is an adorable tweet from Mai, who sings, while Mao moves and does super cute poses.

https://twitter.com/asadamai717/status/616760928780943360/video/1

Translation:

Feel the supremely rejuvenating powers of my cute sister in action.
So cute, you can't help but be rejuvenated ��
Okay, time to get back to earning a living everyone ✌︎

If you have problems with this link above, you can find the tweet and short video clip here:

translated by hurrah at goldenskate forum: http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?38067-Mao-Asada/page104  post 1554
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:41 pm

WowMao wrote:
What version of Madame Butterfly would you like Mao to use?

I would go with a pure instrumental, but the vocal track would be played by an instrument.
Words seem to be very hard to express with skating.
(It's true that exhibitions have words, but in a casual care-free atmosphere and lacking the rigorous detail of regular programs.)

By the way, the book has a slightly different ending than the opera (Butterfly doesn't die).
The quality of writing in the last chapter is astoundingly good:

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/LONG/chap15.html
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/LONG/contents.html

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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sat Jul 04, 2015 1:52 pm

inskate wrote:
zarinaballerina wrote:

I wonder though, and this is something I've seen in the lyrics of Joss Stone's version I've posted above, and also on GS forum, why is the word schön  written as shein?  scratch

I think it's because the original lyrics were written in Yiddish, and as Yiddish has its own alphabet (despite sharing a lot of words with the German language), it can transliterated in various ways. For example, this page with the original lyrics ( LINK ) transliterates the title as "Bay Mir Bistu Sheyn".


Thank you for explaining. flower  I got a bit confused, I thought maybe they had difficulties pronouncing ö in schön. Embarassed

WowMao wrote:
zarinaballerina I know one sad story about a famous American singer named Jim Croce, who had many hits and even number 1 songs "Bad, Bad Leroy Brown" and "Time in a Bottle" (after his death) from the 1970s who was forced to stay away from his family well over 300 days a year on the road and made very little money despite his huge success because of the record contract he signed. He died in an airplane crash while touring. Again after his death, his wife gained better rights for his songs which are still often played on Oldies radio stations today.

There are other examples like the musical group Badfinger also from the 1970s, whose manager actually stole money from them.

Sadly this still happens today. In my country there was an olympic medalist who made quite a bit of money, or to say it better, would've made quite a bit of money, were it not for her manager who stole most of it.  Evil or Very Mad

As for the show industry, the ones making the most money are the record labels. Not to mention all the "couch casting" in film industry. Escape Showbusiness is trully an ugly business.  Yep, Sadly

WowMao wrote:
What version of Madame Butterfly would you like Mao to use?

Definitely an instrumental one. I hope there won't be any singing. She's already using vocals in SP, so there's no need for them in LP. IMO.
I can't wait to see her new programs!  Happy dance
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sat Jul 04, 2015 8:35 pm

zarina ballerina, I actually think Mao had a shot for a medal if the scoring had been done fairly. But, I definitely think she should have had a world record for the LP at Sochi.

Here is an article about Mao returning to competition with a couple of pieces of information that were new to me. Maybe they have already been mentioned, but I hadn't heard them.

1. The article quotes Mao as saying that it was "equally important to continue the same thing for an extended period of time." and that having seen people toiling in various fields outside of skating made her "want to work hard toward something."

2. The article also quoted Mao as saying that she felt she would get injured now if she were to practice for as many hours as she did when she was a teenager. Also, it said that Mao felt it important to pay attention to her sleep and to not practice intensively, if she has pain in her body. Maybe, Mao's "power nap" after her difficult practice session early in the day before her Sochi LP is still fresh in her mind.

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/behind_news/sports/AJ201505290054
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:59 am

BelieveInMaoself wrote:

By the way, the book has a slightly different ending than the opera (Butterfly doesn't die).
The quality of writing in the last chapter is astoundingly good:

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/LONG/chap15.html
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/LONG/contents.html


It's a very interesting book, but I don't like the way the accents are rendered. Is Mao going to read this to help with her interpretation of the program?
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sun Jul 05, 2015 1:20 pm

l-spiralmao wrote:
It's a very interesting book, but I don't like the way the accents are rendered.

That stood out to me as well.
It's important to understand the time period this was written, in a similar era as Mark Twain (whose characterization accents are probably even more offensive). Although it might be politically incorrect in today's world, even a bit outright offensive, the author did not intend it that way.
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sun Jul 05, 2015 7:57 pm

BelieveInMaoself wrote:
l-spiralmao wrote:
It's a very interesting book, but I don't like the way the accents are rendered.

That stood out to me as well.
It's important to understand the time period this was written, in a similar era as Mark Twain (whose characterization accents are probably even more offensive). Although it might be politically incorrect in today's world, even a bit outright offensive, the author did not intend it that way.

I agree it is quite poignant and beautiful literary writing. But, I must admit the story is almost too tragic for me, because in addition to Butterfly I can't help feeling sorrow for the fate of the baby left without a mother, at  least in the opera version and the written version at first did make me feel that Butterfly had also committed seppoko before I went back and saw that the maid had bound up her wound. Her fate seemed a little unclear in the written version. I thought the reference to the empty house also suggested that Butterfly may have died. I suppose I should read the whole thing to make it clearer.
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:02 pm

I posted this a long time ago, but I thought I would do it again for those who haven't seen it. Here is what David Lease of the Skating Lesson and the co-host said about Mao's FS at Sochi.
David states "Mao Asada gave the performance of the night at the Olympics" and "To me that was the moment of the Olympics." He also says, "It was what we want in the Olympic champion and that is everything you could want in a champion." The co-host also says, "That to me was the program of this whole Olympics." and, "When I watched it again, I got emotional just like a big silly baby." The part where they discuss Mao is from
about 18:00-19:00.

http://www.theskatinglesson.com/tsls-2014-olympic-ladies-recap/

I was put off by recent comments by Rafael Artunyunian who has historically backed up Mao quite a bit. Though saying some nice things about Mao such as mentioning her excellent posture and grace, Rafael threw in what I view as quite a critical comment about her: "Despite all her championship titles she has always been fairly stiff on the ice. She has opened up only 30 percent not more." The words "always fairly stiff" fit his words in Russian better than the article translation of "a bit stiff." Some people acted like I was making too big deal about the comment, but I find it to be disrespectful and insulting, especially for someone he has achieved as much as she has in the sport. It is not something Coach Sato would do and to me shows that Coach Sato has more integrity which reflects well on Mao, so I am glad he is her coach, not to mention how much her skating skills, jumps and artistic and emotional expression have improved while he was her coach.
Here is the article: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/index.php?threads/vaytsekhovskayas-interview-with-arutyunian-its-useless-avoiding-fighting-in-the-sports.95908/

The comments made by Mishin, that Mao's triple axel is an illusion and that she has never executed one correctly, is more malicious, even though some people also thought he had been kind to Mao in the past. To me, such statements could potentially be used to keep her scores deflated as reputational downgrades on fully rotated jumps have been in the past.

Outrage at the comments attributed to Mishin, which have never been denied, can be found here.

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?55236-Mao-Asada-plans-comeback/page19


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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Mon Jul 06, 2015 1:35 pm

WowMao wrote:
I was put off by recent comments by Rafael Artunyunian who has historically backed up Mao quite a bit.
...
The comments made by Mishin, that Mao's triple axel is an illusion and that she has never executed one correctly, is more malicious

Here is just my criteria for whether a statement crosses the line, and could theoretically damage a skater's impression on the judges: Whether it is an empirically falsifiable claim, versus just a dumb opinion.

If someone says Mao's jumps are "tiny", "lower than skater X", "never fully rotated" - these are falsifiable claims. Empirical statements are not personal opinions and can be disproved with hard evidence. Physical qualities (height, rotation, GOE etc) are measurable, and therefore any claims about them are inherently true or false. I do think these kinds of false claims are destructive, and should be debunked. It is indeed possible that mass repetition of such statements could taint the judging. Mishin's statement would fall into this category (assuming the newspaper didn't make it up).

Now Rafael's remark is dumb and he should not have said it, but it seems more like a dumb opinion that slipped out the wrong way. Opinions may be offensive, but they don't have the same negative impact as false empirical statements.

That's just the way I see it. I do understand how it feels when any public figure says anything that is not completely positive about Mao's skating, it definitely pushes the wrong buttons.


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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Tue Jul 07, 2015 3:05 pm

BelieveInMaoself wrote:
WowMao wrote:
I was put off by recent comments by Rafael Artunyunian who has historically backed up Mao quite a bit.
...
The comments made by Mishin, that Mao's triple axel is an illusion and that she has never executed one correctly, is more malicious

Here is just my criteria for whether a statement crosses the line, and could theoretically damage a skater's impression on the judges: Whether it is an empirically falsifiable claim, versus just a dumb opinion.

If someone says Mao's jumps are "tiny", "lower than skater X", "never fully rotated" - these are falsifiable claims. Empirical statements are not personal opinions and can be disproved with hard evidence. Physical qualities (height, rotation, GOE etc) are measurable, and therefore any claims about them are inherently true or false. I do think these kinds of false claims are destructive, and should be debunked. It is indeed possible that mass repetition of such statements could taint the judging. Mishin's statement would fall into this category (assuming the newspaper didn't make it up).

Now Rafael's remark is dumb and he should not have said it, but it seems more like a dumb opinion that slipped out the wrong way. Opinions may be offensive, but they don't have the same negative impact as false empirical statements.

That's just the way I see it. I do understand how it feels when any public figure says anything that is not completely positive about Mao's skating, it definitely pushes the wrong buttons.



I comletely agree with your criteria, BelieveInMaoself. To this day, I still can't believe Mishin had actually said that. I would like to think that the media misquoted him on purpose to stir things a bit. Otherwise, it's a totally disgusting thing to say, and I would lose all respect for him, if it turns out it's not a media fabrication. I really like Mishin, so I don't want to believe he would stoop so low. pale

As for Rafael; I think the words or translation came out wrong. IMO, what he wanted to say, or at least this is how I understand it, is that despite of all Mao's greatness, she's never shown her true self on the ice, opened up to the audience, or at least not fully. So now that she's had a chance to experience life outside skating, experience new things, he's interested to see if this has impacted her as a skater. Will she still be amazing yet "closed up" to the audience, or will she open up completely.
I hope I'm making any sense. Embarassed

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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Tue Jul 07, 2015 7:54 pm

[/quote]I comletely agree with your criteria, BelieveInMaoself. To this day, I still can't believe Mishin had actually said that. I would like to think that the media misquoted him on purpose to stir things a bit. Otherwise, it's a totally disgusting thing to say, and I would lose all respect for him, if it turns out it's not a media fabrication. I really like Mishin, so I don't want to believe he would stoop so low. pale

As for Rafael; I think the words or translation came out wrong. IMO, what he wanted to say, or at least this is how I understand it, is that despite of all Mao's greatness, she's never shown her true self on the ice, opened up to the audience, or at least not fully. So now that she's had a chance to experience life outside skating, experience new things, he's interested to see if this has impacted her as a skater. Will she still be amazing yet "closed up" to the audience, or will she open up completely.
I hope I'm making any sense. Embarassed[/quote]

I understand what you are saying, zarinaballerina. More people think I don't make sense than you on the forums. I went back and edited my post to soften it a bit about Arutyunian's comments because I don't know his true intention, but I truly believe they were inappropriate and disrespectful to Mao's talent and effort. But my outrage at Mishin' comments (or at least his decision not to deny such widely circulated comments) is consistent with a lot of posters as can be seen in the link I posted. My feeling is that Arutyunian's comment is one in a long line of statements and opinions that are allowed to circulate about Mao that would be criticized if they were made about other great skaters and that don't coincide with my own observations of her performances. On forums, people regularly get away with saying Mao is very inconsistent or a "headcase"(despite all her championship wins and legendary performances), that she has chronic ur problems and weak jumping technique (despite the fact that so many of the calls are obviously bogus, that she was the most consistent woman ever to land the triple axel and triple flip and loop, despite her 8 triple Sochi LP and despite evidence from people like one of my best friends who had never seen Mao skate and thought she had the most beautiful jumps at Sochi).

Many also subscribe to the stereotype that Mao doesn't "emote" or "open up" on the ice (despite the fact that she skates in what I consider to be more of an Eastern style of subtlety with refined and incredibly elegant and athletic balletic extensions and Zen like focus on a dazzling array of technical elements punctuated with bursts of passion. Even those who feel she gets bad calls and is underscored often try to excuse it based on her (mostly erroneous) reputation for downgrades or her alleged "extreme inconsistency" and inability to "open up emotionally" for deflated PCS). And this in turn, could allow many people to look the other way when the obvious underscoring continues in the future. Media image, the right backing and reputation are often more important than actual performance in determining scores and have subtle influences even on people like me who were fans of Mao, until I started investigated her underscoring.

Here is a list of photos that I think contradicts the stereotype that Mao is stiff emotionally and doesn't open up, one of which is my avatar. It was the intensity of Mao's performances, the way I felt like she was giving every ounce of herself, and the way she often broke down in tears from expending such effort (as in her Worlds 2007 LP, Grand Prix Final LP 2007 and Sochi LP) that really drew me to her skating. Mao has opened up in her performances more than anyone I have ever seen, so that's why I find Arutyunian's comment disrespectful and dismissive of her efforts.
I was also drawn to her skating by her incredibly expressive, genuine and dramatic facial expressions, which I notice even more when I see her photos. I also think Mao expresses the widest range of moods and emotions (from innocent joy, to dark desperation, melancholy and bittersweet redemptions) and she often combines her expressions with a visually stunning pose or element as a difficult spiral, spin or complex move in the step sequence that makes it more of a natural extension of the intensity in her performance and adds greatly to its authenticity, instead of what is taken for more tradition "emoting" or "opening up" which is the perpetual wide grin or "taking a break" and consciously posing for the camera in the middle of the performance.
As one poster wrote about her SOchi LP, "What more could she have done?"

Here are the photos:
Like these: Like these: http://jto.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/sp20130210f1a.jpg

http://www.globaltimes.cn/attachment/100328/bc3186b4df.jpg

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/fe/a1/ae/fea1aea0064853cdefc7320b8baa5cf0.jpg

http://jto.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/p14-jack-a-20131107.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CAX1hLhUQAAci8K.jpg:large

http://sportsspecial.mainichi.jp/graph/2014sochi/figureLadies/image/064.jpg

http://cdn.tokyotimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/asada.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4031/4313911106_16d4dd7144.jpg

http://model343.kireiblog.excite.co.jp/files/15/51/0811/20130211085115_0.jpeg

http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/socho2824ech-echko/imgs/9/f/9f7c94a3.jpg

http://www.glamour.com/images/entertainment/2014/02/mao-asada-2-main.jpg

http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/76efafaf7cc0d6a6657dd361d9112c6ef9061107/c=0-207-2756-3885&r=537&c=0-0-534-712/local/-/media/USATODAY/USATODAY/2014/03/29//1396104476000-GTY-481279815.jpg

http://jto.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/p16-jack-b-20140319.jpg

http://jto.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/sp20111226f1a.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_h3HborB6LT8/TMXQjUKQk3I/AAAAAAAAJyo/C756p0c1ojw/s1600/Asada+free+skate.jpg

http://iluvsk8.blog.fc2.com/img/Mao-Asada-Triple-Axel-Moscow-of-Bells-Best-Program-2009-2010-WC-Olympics009.jpg/

http://sktbiyori.cocolog-nifty.com/photos/uncategorized/2013/09/19/mao_asada_i_got_rhythm_sp_2012_2013.jpg

http://figuregallery.tistory.com/entry/Mao-ASADA-%E6%B5%85%E7%94%B0-%E7%9C%9F%E5%A4%AE-Grand-Prix-of-Figure-Skating-Final-Gala-Show


Last edited by WowMao on Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:52 am; edited 11 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:44 am

zarinaballerina wrote:
I comletely agree with your criteria, BelieveInMaoself.

I thought about that sentence again and it could be put more succinctly: False fact vs opinion.
(The full legal term is "False statements of fact".)

WowMao wrote:
It was the intensity of Mao's performances, the way I felt like she was giving every ounce of herself, and the way she often broke down in tears from expending such effort (as in her Worlds 2007 LP, Grand Prix Final LP 2007 and Sochi LP) that really drew me to her skating.

The emotion that comes out on the ice is 100% real feelings and not scripted acting.
Even if her athletic ability were mediocre, she would still be the best to me for this one quality.
A few musicians have an analogous gift, but no other skater.
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:21 am

WowMao wrote:

I understand what you are saying, zarinaballerina. More people think I don't make sense than you on the forums. I went back and edited my post to soften it a bit about Arutyunian's comments because I don't know his true intention, but I truly believe they were inappropriate and disrespectful to Mao's talent and effort.  But my outrage at Mishin' comments (or at least his decision not to deny such widely circulated comments) is consistent with a lot of posters as can be seen in the link I posted. My feeling is that Arutyunian's comment is one in a long line of statements and opinions that are allowed to circulate about Mao that would be criticized if they were made about other great skaters and that don't coincide with my own observations of her performances.

I was also drawn to her skating by her incredibly expressive, genuine and dramatic facial expressions, which I notice even more when I see her photos. I also think Mao expresses the widest range of moods and emotions (from innocent joy, to dark desperation, melancholy and bittersweet redemptions) and she often combines her expressions with a visually stunning pose or element as a difficult spiral, spin or complex move in the step sequence that makes it more of a natural extension of the intensity in her performance and adds greatly to its authenticity, instead of what is taken for more tradition "emoting" or "opening up" which is the perpetual wide grin or "taking a break" and consciously posing for the camera in the middle of the performance.  

WowMao, it was never my intention to make you feel as if you're not making any sense in your anger over Rafael's comments. I am trully sorry, if my post came across this way. Crying or Very sad  I love your posts here, your detailed analysis of Mao's gorgeous skating Love Hearts , I was just trying to find a positive in Rafa's comment. I was also doing some more thinking, and maybe the stiff comment was about her being nervous or worried about how her jumps, especially 3A will go, so instead of relaxing out there, she becomes stiff?  scratch  I don't know, maybe I'm reaching here, but in all his interviews (and I have not read all of them, ) so far, all I heard were good things about Mao. And I think you can still tell he's feeling sorry or guilty about the way they parted.


Oh don't get me wrong, I was pissed beyond reason at Mishin for that quote. But since as I've said I really like him (though I've never actually met him), I am for the time willing to give him a benefit of doubt and wait. Mao is coming back, so I'm sure he'll be sharing his opinions again, so I'll wait until then. I really hope the media just made it up, otherwise... Depressed Crying  Disappointed  Evil or Very Mad

I completely agree with you about Mao's incredible expressive skating. I hope her interpretation of music never changes. If she'll ever turn into an over dramatic posing for cameras type of a skater, I'll be running away screaming bloody murder for whomever made her change into this.  Twisted Evil I've always said, acting a program is very easy, all you have to do is know what the stroy is about, place yourself in front of a mirror and practice different expressions. Now actually feeling the music and expressing it with your entire body, that is an art. And Mao is very, very good at it. However, beacuse she's subtle about it and not over the top in your face, many are saying she's cold or isn't feeling the music. Rolling Eyes  And then I look at the pics from competition and see so much passion and expresiveness on her face, not to mention (like you said) in her poses and I find myself baffled at those people. I get it, they were elevating their favourite by bringing Mao down, but how can you call yourself a profesional journalist and figure skating commentator, if you're saying the same nonsense as the haters do.  Disappointed

Anyway, I hope Mao is coming back with a huge bang and will silence the critics and haters for good!  Yep!  cheers  Cheering
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:41 am

zarinaballerina wrote:
WowMao wrote:

[b]

WowMao, it was never my intention to make you feel as if you're not making any sense in your anger over Rafael's comments. I am trully sorry, if my post came across this way. Crying or Very sad  I love your posts here, your detailed analysis of Mao's gorgeous skating Love Hearts , I was just trying to find a positive in Rafa's comment. I was also doing some more thinking, and maybe the stiff comment was about her being nervous or worried about how her jumps, especially 3A will go, so instead of relaxing out there, she becomes stiff?  scratch  I don't know, maybe I'm reaching here, but in all his interviews (and I have not read all of them, ) so far, all I heard were good things about Mao. And I think you can still tell he's feeling sorry or guilty about the way they parted.


Oh don't get me wrong, I was pissed beyond reason at Mishin for that quote. But since as I've said I really like him (though I've never actually met him), I am for the time willing to give him a benefit of doubt and wait. Mao is coming back, so I'm sure he'll be sharing his opinions again, so I'll wait until then. I really hope the media just made it up, otherwise... Depressed Crying  Disappointed  Evil or Very Mad

I completely agree with you about Mao's incredible expressive skating. I hope her interpretation of music never changes. If she'll ever turn into an over dramatic posing for cameras type of a skater, I'll be running away screaming bloody murder for whomever made her change into this.  Twisted Evil I've always said, acting a program is very easy, all you have to do is know what the stroy is about, place yourself in front of a mirror and practice different expressions. Now actually feeling the music and expressing it with your entire body, that is an art. And Mao is very, very good at it. However, beacuse she's subtle about it and not over the top in your face, many are saying she's cold or isn't feeling the music. Rolling Eyes  And then I look at the pics from competition and see so much passion and expresiveness on her face, not to mention (like you said) in her poses and I find myself baffled at those people. I get it, they were elevating their favourite by bringing Mao down, but how can you call yourself a profesional journalist and figure skating commentator, if you're saying the same nonsense as the haters do.  Disappointed

Anyway, I hope Mao is coming back with a huge bang and will silence the critics and haters for good!  Yep!  cheers  Cheering

That's fine, zarinaballerina. I wasn't talking about you, but some posters on fsuniverse.  I just think some coaches take liberties with criticism when it is more noble to show respect for other competitors and keep criticism to themselves and that "more connected" coaches are often let off the hook too easily for disrespectful comments.  I wish Mao the very best this season and it will be a great joy to see her skate again, I just look it all as a bonus now because she is already a legend and I know Mao will skate with all the heart, soul, guts and beauty she can muster, which is more important to me than some empirical score that is often suspect in the first place.      

To BelieveinMaoSelf, It wasn't just Mao's emotional intensity by the dazzling balletic positions, spirals and spins and the airy, butterfly jumps with the slight delay, rapid rotation and beautiful symmetrical air position that also initially attracting me to Mao's skating. The fascination with the step sequences came later.

yhma fan at goldenskate posted this beautiful picture of the actress Kaoru Yachigusa, who they said is now 84 years old. She said that the version of Madame Butterfly she starred in is the most popular and beloved “Madame Butterfly” in Japan.

https://41.media.tumblr.com/f772e5127b76070800b80dd657e88cfe/tumblr_nr62fqYLFc1uv57j0o1_540.png

Here is a bigger picture of Kaoru Yachigusa playing Madame Butterfly in 1956:
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/portrait-of-japanese-actress-kaoru-yachigusa-as-she-appears-news-photo/551439773

According to the age that yhma fan has given, Mao would be almost the same age as Kaoru in this second picture when she skates to Madame Butterfly later this season, since the picture was taken in 1956. Mao will be 25 when she skates to it at the Japan Open and Kaoru must be close to 25 in the picture.


The site for the original post is: http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?38067-Mao-Asada/page105
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:30 am

rosewood at fsuniverse  posted an article that gave Mao's training schedule. According to her, she is not sure about the article's reliability, but she did say that Mao verified on her radio show that she gets up at 4am, does off ice training beginning at 5am and on ice training with Coach Sato beginning at 6am. rosewood then says that the rest of the information comes from the article posted below: In the morning, Mao does on-ice training for 2 hours, takes a break, and then exercises in a gym or takes ballet lessons.  Then, she goes back to her hotel to have lunch, take a two hour nap, and starts training again on ice from 6 pm to 8 pm. rosewood says that the article also says she is quite focused.

The link for the article in Japanese is:

http://jisin.jp/news/2686/8739/?next

For more information about Mao's training, please see the following link: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/index.php?threads/the-mao-cheer-thread-2-her-beauty-is-her-biggest-weapon.95911/page-2#post-4547824  posts 50 and 53

hurrah at goldenskate translated Mao's comments about her training: http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?38067-Mao-Asada&p=1193014#post1193014

Here is the post: This is the radio program where Mao talked about her day:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drixfcFt7oA

She said she gets up at 4am, eats breakfast and does something to make her body fully awake, starts warming up and stretching at 5am, and starts skating at 6am. She skates for an hour and a bit, then takes a little break, and then skates for another hour and a bit, and then takes a little break. Then she skates again where she has the ice rink all to herself. This ends at 11am. Then she has 'recovery time', and then has lunch. After lunch, she takes a nap, and then goes back to the rink. She has a 45-minute skating session which starts at 7pm.

The above is a pretty accurate description of what she said on the radio program. So she didn't talk much about what she does until 7pm when she goes back to the rink after her nap, so maybe this varies from day to day.

In any case, Mao is practicing hard!!
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:57 pm

Here is an article about Mao returning to competition with a couple of pieces of information that were new to me. Maybe they have already been mentioned, but I hadn't heard them.

1. The article quotes Mao as saying that it was "equally important to continue the same thing for an extended period of time." and that having seen people toiling in various fields outside of skating made her "want to work hard toward something."

2. The article also quoted Mao as saying that she felt she would get injured now if she were to practice for as many hours as she did when she was a teenager. Also, it said that Mao felt it important to pay attention to her sleep and to not practice intensively, if she has pain in her body. Maybe, Mao's "power nap" after her difficult practice session early in the day before her Sochi LP is still fresh in her mind.

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/behind_news/sports/AJ201505290054
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:33 am

Japan Open 2015 Participants (as of now)

Mao Asada
Satoko Miyahara

Ashley Wagner
Gracie Gold

Adelina Sotnikova
Javier Fernandez

http://www.tv-tokyo.co.jp/japanopen2015/

I can't wait!  Cheering
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Tue Jul 14, 2015 8:06 am

This is a news passed from twitter the other day. Although I usually don't trust such source, but I kind of wanting to believe there's certain reliability behind this one:
http://zasshi.news.yahoo.co.jp/article?a=20150709-00010001-jisin-ent

In the news, it explains why Mao picked 'Puttin' on the ritz' for Ex. The song was actually one of the favorite songs of Mao's mother, Kyoko. When Mao was little, her Mom would drive her to the rink and play the song while driving. Sometimes after a heaving training session, Mao would fall asleep in the car and accompanied by the song. Kyoko once even said that 'Mao will skate to this song when growing up.'

Also, as Mao's radio talk show has finished by the end of June, Mai actually has taken over the talk show with the new 'Mai's young Japan action' during the same time slot. Mai still talks about Mao in her show. And from the most recent broadcasting, Mai reveals that Mao's new costume for the new Ex is 'very cute, and it is quite different from all her previous costumes!'

Can't wait to see THE ICE!!
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Wed Jul 15, 2015 12:35 pm

Edit: That's a really nice story CONK. Like you said, we don't know if it is true though.  

Here is a post giving the times and dates for The Ice to be aired on Japanese television along with the youtube site for the The Ice. Thanks to mikiboo at goldenskate for this post. Evidently, The Ice programs for 2014 have already been taken down so the ones for 2015 probably won't stay up for that long.

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?38067-Mao-Asada/page107  post 1599

I think the first showing will be from Fuji TV on July 25, 9:55-10:55 (only 1 hour )
http://www.fujitv.co.jp/sports/skate/the_ice/index.html

Chukyo TV will have a special program on August 2, 15:00-16:25 with lots of backstage footages and an interview by Midori Ito.

And a program focused on the show itself, on August 15, 1:59-3:59 on Chukyo TV also.
http://www2.ctv.co.jp/spotch/archives/542

Then there is THE ICE channel on YouTube so hopefully we're all covered.
https://www.youtube.com/user/theiceCTV

I just realized they took down all the YT videos from THE ICE 2014
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PostSubject: Re: Mao: post-Sochi news and articles   Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:20 pm

update news report about Mao:

News link:
http://www.daily.co.jp/general/2015/07/18/0008219762.shtml

Rough translation -
The representative of JSF reports that Mao is in good condition and the practice is going upwards. After getting the new programs in June, Mao has been practicing in both Shin-yokohama ice rink and Chukyo U ice rink.

Also, Coach Sato gave a talk in a seminar a few days ago. Of course Mao was mentioned in the talk. From twitter reports, Coach Sato says Mao's practice is progressing smoothly. However, (they are) more concerned if Mao can concentrate and has stamina to work through the 4-min (probably FP) skating. He says they will work on those aspects after The Ice show. In terms of condition management, Mao seems to be doing well so there's nothing to be worried about.

With The Ice show coming up next week, I'm just excited to be able to see Mao's skating again for a long while. But I also don't want her to over-work herself (I read from tweeter previously that she has at least 4 major numbers from the show, including her own EX, collaboration with Caro and Joannie, also the regular one with Jeff editing: now I remember, the 4th program is the revival of one of her old programs as requested from the viewers. that's a lot, isn't it?  Faint2 ). Just hope she takes the time and have a good time with the show!
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